Movie thoughts
Jan. 20th, 2007 12:57 am![[personal profile]](https://www.dreamwidth.org/img/silk/identity/user.png){kind=small}
veronica_richIf you can just sit and watch and enjoy the humor, it's quite enjoyable - at least the first half of the film. (That is, if you don't overthink the whole cannibal thing. Which is hard not to do, knowing how the stories of cannibalism started. But, I digress.)
When Tia Dalma says Will has a touch of destiny, Jack looks worried in a manner that suggests he knows exactly what she's talking about. How much does he know about Will's future? Or perhaps his/his father's supernatural past?
What if Pearl herself is what Jack is loath to claim as his own? After all, tying himself to her ties him to his obligation to Jones, as well - it's like admitting you want that shiny new convertible, but acknowledging that driving it means you have to fork up the $400 monthly payments, when you can barely afford it. (And we all know Jack isn't wise enough to give Pearl up, even to save himself.) In this fashion, I could *sort* of see him fleeing briefly in blind terror when Kraken comes for him. But it's still hard to see him getting that far a-ocean out from her. (![[livejournal.com profile]](https://www.dreamwidth.org/img/external/lj-userinfo.gif)
metalkatt: "But, when the panic subsides, he knows that she is worth it. She always has been.")
Will ends up in the midst of fire in both movies - at the beginning of CotBP when his ship is attacked and burned, as a blacksmith, when the Interceptor is blown up, and when he deliberately sets his sword afire to protect himself against Davy's crew in DMC. I don't know what it means, but it's interesting.
"And did I happen to mention ... he's in LOVE ... with a GIRL." Jack's line always makes me laugh. "I mean, think of it, mate; how could 'e love a GIRL?" *G* (And poor Gibbs, the Caribbean Handiwipe)
Now that Edinburgh captain's a sensible guy; he didn't seem given to superstition. Why didn't HE think to look up in the rigging or for strings on the dress, even if nobody else did?
I like Elizabeth when she's fighting. Not prancing, not batting eyelashes, but fighting. And that "I just wanted the pleasure of doing it myself" line is funny. Girl needs to show a sense of humor more often. Lighten up, honey - nobody is underestimating you, and I can't see where anyone is trapping you in a cage or trying to tell you what not to do.
Technically speaking, you know, Norrington doesn't say the hurricane was AT Tripoli. But how else are you supposed to take it? Hurricanes are far enough from Tripoli that ... well, why would getting caught in one hundreds of miles away matter??
EVERY hat Jack tries on in the pub looks like it came from Party City, is made from felt, and cost less than $10. Where was the costuming budget? Tied up in Will's leather coat? All those $300 boots? ;-)
I guess Davy never goes underwater when Will is aboard his ship. I wonder if Will's the only person on board at that time who isn't oathed to the Dutchman? Seems odd to keep above water just to keep one person alive; Spock wouldn't think it's a logical use of resources. *G* And Bill ... poor, stupid Bill ... why did you admit Will's your son? Why not just say "It was my fault - I let go"? *headshake* Exposition wouldn't be as good, I guess.
Why do Will and Bill never discuss Jack Sparrow, or Elizabeth? They are both fairly important events/people in Will's young life, and the reasons he is aboard.
Hmm. When Lizzie first approaches Jack on the dock, boy, is SHE annoyed at him. ("MEANING, William Turner.") And then Jack proceeds to make great pains to point out HE had nothing to do with Will's capture - that's a sure clue right there that he's got something to do with it. Almost comical admission, in fact. (And I still maintain there's enough sexual tension between Lizzie and Jack to power a light bulb for a flea for about three seconds. There's more charge in that scene between Jack and Norrington snarking at each other.)
"That's not part of the game, is it?" Oh, WILL. Yes, please! (Did I mention this movie did, at least, make me like him more? And not just because he looks good next to everyone else's personal morality going for the toilet, but because he's an interesting character.)
Why is Bill clean-shaven? Did he just happen to shave before pledging himself to the Dutchman? Sonny Boy seems to have no problem growing facial hair quickly.
Will doesn't have a "white knight" complex. He was orphaned at young age and has been parted from the one person he'd found a connection with, his fiancee. He finds Dad alive when he thought the man was dead; he's never known Dad very well. Dad's helping him escape Davy Jones, traded the rest of his soul to help Will with the key. I can understand why Will wants to try to save him; he probably wouldn't be very decent if he didn't.
You know, Lizzie's hair down and loose aboard the Pearl makes me twitch. Because yeah - LONG loose hair is SO much more comfortable flying around your head and into your face and sticking sweatily to your neck and cheeks, than tied back and tucked under a hat.
The young guy on the Edinburgh - cabin boy? I dunno, for some reason I wanna name him Jeremy.
People have complained we see a detailed Kraken attack twice, when once would've been enough. But as far as I'm concerned, we shouldn't have seen that first ship (with Jack's hat) taken down so easily. Not if we're going to get all this fanfare with later attacks. (And I love the music when the Kraken tentacle breaks the ship in half.)
Help me out, if you've read this far: When Davy "senses" Will and looks out over the bow of the ship and it pans down to show the ship itself, are we supposed to see Will hiding down there? 'Cause I can't.
Aside from all else concerning Jack and Elizabeth - her unguarded reaction to his "marriage" thing is pure, unfeigned disbelief (and possibly disgust). What comes *after*, she's actively thinking about and making up as she goes along - the pretend seduction. And Jack is not very concerned about being pulled away from her by "Land, ho!" - a frown and "I want my jar of dirt!" Then, on the island, Lizzie doesn't look particularly put out that the compass is pointing to what's underground, not at her - she moves quickly enough and gladly, it seems.
Awww ... slasher that I am, it's still sweet when Lizzie spots Will with a "Thank God!" and a hug. I wish they were that unguarded with each other more often ... and that we get it in AWE. Even with arguing. Especially with arguing.
Hmm. "I've had it! I've had it with wobbly-legged, rum-soaked pirates!" I think she's really angry and that "piracy" is losing its last shimmers of fantasy for her. She sees her fiance, a sensible man, being pulled into this three-way grudge match, and realizes just how ridiculous everything is getting. (Even though I don't necessarily think the fight is silly - these men all have a complaint against one another in some fashion or other, and I can believe they'd fight and tussle for a while, at least. Especially with that valuable key in play.)
Boy, Jack's annoyed with either Will or James on top of that mill. Snarking away - I can't tell which one it's aimed at more. (I'd like to think Will, but again, that's just slashiness getting the best of me.)
There's a couple of seconds on top of the wheel, near the beginning, when Will and James stop and look at each other as Jack goes by, with a sort of "What the hell ARE we doing??" expression. I swear, if they weren't moving, they might stop fighting.
How DOES little, wiry Jack throw a coconut that far?? With an arm like that, he should be in the majors!
Damn, that is one enlarged heart. Maybe Davy cut it out just in time to save himself a cardiac arrest!
Why does everyone stop fighting for so long when the wheels goes by - and then start right back up all at the same time, as if by agreement? "Here now! Five seconds to gawk, by the International Code of Naval Warfare!"
WHAMMO! I don't know why, but I *love* that scene when Will is piecing together silently about the chest and the key and the dirt in the boat, and Jack spots him and just KNOWS, enough to knock him out before he can call Jack on it. There's more understood between those two, unspoken, than entire scenes of some of the other characters expositing to one another for several lines of dialogue.
How is it the Pearl can outrun the Dutchman? Is that a Tia Dalma charm? After all, Pearl owes her continued existence to Davy and the Dutchman - it wouldn't stand to reason that a prize could get away that easily, without outside help. (In that case, why is Tia trying to vex Davy? If she is his lost love, does she have it in for him in some fashion? Maybe she never loved him - she never expressly says that Davy's love was requited, I don't think.)
When Will spots the powder barrel and is trying to decide what to do next, to haul the net aloft and himself as distraction for Kraken ... I love his expression as he's thinking, planning it all out. Yeah, he's pretty - but it's when he displays pure brains that I *like* the character. Same with any of them, including Lizzie.
You know, I've said before that I could probably accept Lizzie chaining Jack to the mast, if I didn't think it was even a little bit because she's angry with him for inciting her hormones somewhat (which, thanks to the writers, we know is indeed the case - even if they took their speciic wording to explain it from yet another writer; they agreed with it). But it's also because it's just a lousy thing to do to a friend, someone who has saved your life twice before. (And I REALLY can't accept that Jack would have any sexual feelings toward her after such as that. It doesn't matter how much he thought she could justify doing it, that's a very personal thing to suffer, death and being EATEN of all things.) And I can see how a kiss is distracting - but I can't buy that Jack wouldn't know it was a distraction. I cannot BUY that he thought she was sincere, and that he was foolish enough to be taken in by it. This is the part where my enjoyment really broke down, because it makes no sense given what we know of the characters.
You know the smile everyone goes on about Jack giving Lizzie when she chains him to the mast? The one many think is indicative of his doe-eyed love for her as his presumptive pirate queen? He uses the same smile less than five minutes later - "Hello, Beastie" - and in CotBP when Koehler and Twigg incite his little rant about betrayers and mutineers. (Go back and look. Same expression.)
I still like the idea all these people in the swamp are freed slaves, or the progeny of same, left there by Jack and that's what led to Jack's expulsion from society as a pirate and the sinking of his ship. (Possibly Jack is salvageable from World's End because of this very moral act that caused him to have to ask Jones for help in the first place in raising the Pearl?)
Ah, Tia Dalma. (Side note: I have ALWAYS liked strong women, both in real life and in my entertainment. You look at the female characters I've latched onto over 30 years of reading and viewing, they're the ones who get things done, speak their mind, and mostly have confidence with and around men. But I expect them to have dignity, brains, and a sense of humor. Elizabeth Swann doesn't show enough of the first, has loads of the second, and possesses almost none of the third. I can name offhand ten gung-ho female characters who manage to be sexy and still outclass Lizzie.)
I love the way Barbossa just laughs at how everyone's looking at him. No doubt for him, this journey will be a hell of a lot more fun and rewarding than it will be for any of them. (Except possibly Tia Dalma.)
In short: I feel more forgiving toward DMC than I used to. It's been a few months, and there are parts I enjoy watching. Do I think it's a good movie? Not strictly speaking, because it has no resolution, no ending. The basic story isn't bad, but it has too many loose ends that are critical to finish the main storylines. Also, there are characters I liked from the first movie, that I no longer care for as much. I don't mind flaws and faults and cracks in my characters, but I dislike bad logic to explain it. Finally, there doesn't seem to be a clear direction for anything - there's too much meandering and mystery and enigma. A certain amount is charming - but when the writers have to explain a basic point to make you understand what you're seeing, that's a sign there should've been more on celluloid regarding that point.
When Tia Dalma says Will has a touch of destiny, Jack looks worried in a manner that suggests he knows exactly what she's talking about. How much does he know about Will's future? Or perhaps his/his father's supernatural past?
What if Pearl herself is what Jack is loath to claim as his own? After all, tying himself to her ties him to his obligation to Jones, as well - it's like admitting you want that shiny new convertible, but acknowledging that driving it means you have to fork up the $400 monthly payments, when you can barely afford it. (And we all know Jack isn't wise enough to give Pearl up, even to save himself.) In this fashion, I could *sort* of see him fleeing briefly in blind terror when Kraken comes for him. But it's still hard to see him getting that far a-ocean out from her. (
metalkatt: "But, when the panic subsides, he knows that she is worth it. She always has been.")Will ends up in the midst of fire in both movies - at the beginning of CotBP when his ship is attacked and burned, as a blacksmith, when the Interceptor is blown up, and when he deliberately sets his sword afire to protect himself against Davy's crew in DMC. I don't know what it means, but it's interesting.
"And did I happen to mention ... he's in LOVE ... with a GIRL." Jack's line always makes me laugh. "I mean, think of it, mate; how could 'e love a GIRL?" *G* (And poor Gibbs, the Caribbean Handiwipe)
Now that Edinburgh captain's a sensible guy; he didn't seem given to superstition. Why didn't HE think to look up in the rigging or for strings on the dress, even if nobody else did?
I like Elizabeth when she's fighting. Not prancing, not batting eyelashes, but fighting. And that "I just wanted the pleasure of doing it myself" line is funny. Girl needs to show a sense of humor more often. Lighten up, honey - nobody is underestimating you, and I can't see where anyone is trapping you in a cage or trying to tell you what not to do.
Technically speaking, you know, Norrington doesn't say the hurricane was AT Tripoli. But how else are you supposed to take it? Hurricanes are far enough from Tripoli that ... well, why would getting caught in one hundreds of miles away matter??
EVERY hat Jack tries on in the pub looks like it came from Party City, is made from felt, and cost less than $10. Where was the costuming budget? Tied up in Will's leather coat? All those $300 boots? ;-)
I guess Davy never goes underwater when Will is aboard his ship. I wonder if Will's the only person on board at that time who isn't oathed to the Dutchman? Seems odd to keep above water just to keep one person alive; Spock wouldn't think it's a logical use of resources. *G* And Bill ... poor, stupid Bill ... why did you admit Will's your son? Why not just say "It was my fault - I let go"? *headshake* Exposition wouldn't be as good, I guess.
Why do Will and Bill never discuss Jack Sparrow, or Elizabeth? They are both fairly important events/people in Will's young life, and the reasons he is aboard.
Hmm. When Lizzie first approaches Jack on the dock, boy, is SHE annoyed at him. ("MEANING, William Turner.") And then Jack proceeds to make great pains to point out HE had nothing to do with Will's capture - that's a sure clue right there that he's got something to do with it. Almost comical admission, in fact. (And I still maintain there's enough sexual tension between Lizzie and Jack to power a light bulb for a flea for about three seconds. There's more charge in that scene between Jack and Norrington snarking at each other.)
"That's not part of the game, is it?" Oh, WILL. Yes, please! (Did I mention this movie did, at least, make me like him more? And not just because he looks good next to everyone else's personal morality going for the toilet, but because he's an interesting character.)
Why is Bill clean-shaven? Did he just happen to shave before pledging himself to the Dutchman? Sonny Boy seems to have no problem growing facial hair quickly.
Will doesn't have a "white knight" complex. He was orphaned at young age and has been parted from the one person he'd found a connection with, his fiancee. He finds Dad alive when he thought the man was dead; he's never known Dad very well. Dad's helping him escape Davy Jones, traded the rest of his soul to help Will with the key. I can understand why Will wants to try to save him; he probably wouldn't be very decent if he didn't.
You know, Lizzie's hair down and loose aboard the Pearl makes me twitch. Because yeah - LONG loose hair is SO much more comfortable flying around your head and into your face and sticking sweatily to your neck and cheeks, than tied back and tucked under a hat.
The young guy on the Edinburgh - cabin boy? I dunno, for some reason I wanna name him Jeremy.
People have complained we see a detailed Kraken attack twice, when once would've been enough. But as far as I'm concerned, we shouldn't have seen that first ship (with Jack's hat) taken down so easily. Not if we're going to get all this fanfare with later attacks. (And I love the music when the Kraken tentacle breaks the ship in half.)
Help me out, if you've read this far: When Davy "senses" Will and looks out over the bow of the ship and it pans down to show the ship itself, are we supposed to see Will hiding down there? 'Cause I can't.
Aside from all else concerning Jack and Elizabeth - her unguarded reaction to his "marriage" thing is pure, unfeigned disbelief (and possibly disgust). What comes *after*, she's actively thinking about and making up as she goes along - the pretend seduction. And Jack is not very concerned about being pulled away from her by "Land, ho!" - a frown and "I want my jar of dirt!" Then, on the island, Lizzie doesn't look particularly put out that the compass is pointing to what's underground, not at her - she moves quickly enough and gladly, it seems.
Awww ... slasher that I am, it's still sweet when Lizzie spots Will with a "Thank God!" and a hug. I wish they were that unguarded with each other more often ... and that we get it in AWE. Even with arguing. Especially with arguing.
Hmm. "I've had it! I've had it with wobbly-legged, rum-soaked pirates!" I think she's really angry and that "piracy" is losing its last shimmers of fantasy for her. She sees her fiance, a sensible man, being pulled into this three-way grudge match, and realizes just how ridiculous everything is getting. (Even though I don't necessarily think the fight is silly - these men all have a complaint against one another in some fashion or other, and I can believe they'd fight and tussle for a while, at least. Especially with that valuable key in play.)
Boy, Jack's annoyed with either Will or James on top of that mill. Snarking away - I can't tell which one it's aimed at more. (I'd like to think Will, but again, that's just slashiness getting the best of me.)
There's a couple of seconds on top of the wheel, near the beginning, when Will and James stop and look at each other as Jack goes by, with a sort of "What the hell ARE we doing??" expression. I swear, if they weren't moving, they might stop fighting.
How DOES little, wiry Jack throw a coconut that far?? With an arm like that, he should be in the majors!
Damn, that is one enlarged heart. Maybe Davy cut it out just in time to save himself a cardiac arrest!
Why does everyone stop fighting for so long when the wheels goes by - and then start right back up all at the same time, as if by agreement? "Here now! Five seconds to gawk, by the International Code of Naval Warfare!"
WHAMMO! I don't know why, but I *love* that scene when Will is piecing together silently about the chest and the key and the dirt in the boat, and Jack spots him and just KNOWS, enough to knock him out before he can call Jack on it. There's more understood between those two, unspoken, than entire scenes of some of the other characters expositing to one another for several lines of dialogue.
How is it the Pearl can outrun the Dutchman? Is that a Tia Dalma charm? After all, Pearl owes her continued existence to Davy and the Dutchman - it wouldn't stand to reason that a prize could get away that easily, without outside help. (In that case, why is Tia trying to vex Davy? If she is his lost love, does she have it in for him in some fashion? Maybe she never loved him - she never expressly says that Davy's love was requited, I don't think.)
When Will spots the powder barrel and is trying to decide what to do next, to haul the net aloft and himself as distraction for Kraken ... I love his expression as he's thinking, planning it all out. Yeah, he's pretty - but it's when he displays pure brains that I *like* the character. Same with any of them, including Lizzie.
You know, I've said before that I could probably accept Lizzie chaining Jack to the mast, if I didn't think it was even a little bit because she's angry with him for inciting her hormones somewhat (which, thanks to the writers, we know is indeed the case - even if they took their speciic wording to explain it from yet another writer; they agreed with it). But it's also because it's just a lousy thing to do to a friend, someone who has saved your life twice before. (And I REALLY can't accept that Jack would have any sexual feelings toward her after such as that. It doesn't matter how much he thought she could justify doing it, that's a very personal thing to suffer, death and being EATEN of all things.) And I can see how a kiss is distracting - but I can't buy that Jack wouldn't know it was a distraction. I cannot BUY that he thought she was sincere, and that he was foolish enough to be taken in by it. This is the part where my enjoyment really broke down, because it makes no sense given what we know of the characters.
You know the smile everyone goes on about Jack giving Lizzie when she chains him to the mast? The one many think is indicative of his doe-eyed love for her as his presumptive pirate queen? He uses the same smile less than five minutes later - "Hello, Beastie" - and in CotBP when Koehler and Twigg incite his little rant about betrayers and mutineers. (Go back and look. Same expression.)
I still like the idea all these people in the swamp are freed slaves, or the progeny of same, left there by Jack and that's what led to Jack's expulsion from society as a pirate and the sinking of his ship. (Possibly Jack is salvageable from World's End because of this very moral act that caused him to have to ask Jones for help in the first place in raising the Pearl?)
Ah, Tia Dalma. (Side note: I have ALWAYS liked strong women, both in real life and in my entertainment. You look at the female characters I've latched onto over 30 years of reading and viewing, they're the ones who get things done, speak their mind, and mostly have confidence with and around men. But I expect them to have dignity, brains, and a sense of humor. Elizabeth Swann doesn't show enough of the first, has loads of the second, and possesses almost none of the third. I can name offhand ten gung-ho female characters who manage to be sexy and still outclass Lizzie.)
I love the way Barbossa just laughs at how everyone's looking at him. No doubt for him, this journey will be a hell of a lot more fun and rewarding than it will be for any of them. (Except possibly Tia Dalma.)
In short: I feel more forgiving toward DMC than I used to. It's been a few months, and there are parts I enjoy watching. Do I think it's a good movie? Not strictly speaking, because it has no resolution, no ending. The basic story isn't bad, but it has too many loose ends that are critical to finish the main storylines. Also, there are characters I liked from the first movie, that I no longer care for as much. I don't mind flaws and faults and cracks in my characters, but I dislike bad logic to explain it. Finally, there doesn't seem to be a clear direction for anything - there's too much meandering and mystery and enigma. A certain amount is charming - but when the writers have to explain a basic point to make you understand what you're seeing, that's a sign there should've been more on celluloid regarding that point.
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no subject
Date: 2007-01-20 06:21 am (UTC)I note that you don't mention how it would have been smarter for her to hide the chest instead of throwing a two-year-old's tantrum, and pouting like a child.
I still say the *real* triangle is Barbossa-Tia-Jones.
The writers have to explain it because *they* don't understand it... because they suck. :P
no subject
Date: 2007-01-21 01:59 am (UTC)no subject
Date: 2007-01-20 06:53 am (UTC)I don't think we are. I never have seen him either.
The Durchman didn't dive because supposedly it's faster for them to travel above the water. The Pearl's faster because isn't she a smaller boat?
The smile Jack gives Liz is supposed to be doe-eyed? Really? I thought it was closer to shit-eating, myself.
no subject
Date: 2007-01-20 06:56 am (UTC)I would think smaller would be smaller. Remember the Armada?
The smile Jack gives Liz is supposed to be doe-eyed? Really? I thought it was closer to shit-eating, myself.
*grins*
no subject
Date: 2007-01-20 07:01 am (UTC)I heard that smaller ships would have an advantage because they'd sail faster. That's why the Interceptor was faster than the Dauntless, it was smaller, wasn't it?
*grins*
Was that supposed to be doe-eyed too?
no subject
Date: 2007-01-20 07:05 am (UTC)no subject
Date: 2007-01-20 07:06 am (UTC)no subject
Date: 2007-01-20 08:12 am (UTC)I've always though that Jack is dealing with bigger issues than Elizabeth when it comes to his stupid compass. I thought that maybe it was an immortality thing, Jack wants it, Jones offers, it but it comes at far to high a price (slavery basically). But I like your 'Pearl' analogy. It's a commitment thing, and we all know Jack places his freedom above all else, and here the 'Pearl' represents a loss of that through 'her' connection and the subsequent obligations to Jones.
You know, Lizzie's hair down and loose aboard the Pearl makes me twitch.
This drove me nuts the first time I saw DMC. I was grumbling and growling through the whole scene and completely missed Jack's twelve-year-old yuck face and wrist grab at the mention of Beckett. I have long hair myself (recently had 6" cut off and its still at my waist) and almost always wear it up because, while it's pretty, it is rarely practical, it gets in and caught on shit all the time (doors, food, trees, not to mention other peoples watches, jewelry, cloths, mouths, hands). And the fact that she plopped her hat on the whole mess, just invoked a complete and utter melt-down.
Awww ... slasher that I am, it's still sweet when Lizzie spots Will with a "Thank God!" and a hug.
I really like what little see of Will and Elizabeth together, and what it says about their actual relationship, prior to the whole KOD thing. It actually made me a bit of a closet W/E shipper.
Boy, Jack's annoyed with either Will or James on top of that mill.
I always felt that Jack and Will were mostly irritated with each other during the three-way sword fight (why yes my glasses are Turrow shaded, why do you ask?). Jack is irritated because once again Will is messing with his carefully laid (see; slap-dash) plans, and Will is pissed that Jack is trying to take something that both he and his father worked so hard (and sacrificed so much) for, Norry just wants the key, and he'll take his revenge, or what ever, if he can while he's at it. But for Jack and Will there are deeper issues of trust, betrayal, quasi-friendship (and sexual tension XP). Jack is practically gleeful in turning Norry against Will, he seems almost proud, despite being kind of spiteful. And Will's face as he realizes what Jack's doing is delightful, he goes from 'WTF' to 'oh shit'.
I do love that earlier in the fight, when Jack has the upper hand on Will and the opportunity to do some damage, he instead smacks him on the ass with the flat of his sword (hee), steals the key and runs for it.
I *love* that scene when Will is piecing together silently about the chest and the key and the dirt in the boat
You and me both. For all of the reasons you stated, it makes my little heart jiggle with joy. And the follow up "Leave him lie, unless you plan on using him to hit something with.", its weird, but I actually thought that was kind of sweet.
I feel more forgiving toward DMC than I used to.
I vacillate back and forth on this a great deal. But mostly I realize that I won't really know how I feel about DMC until I've seen everything tied up (hopefully) in AWE.
no subject
Date: 2007-01-20 08:38 am (UTC)I'm so glad you posted that little tidbit. It looked like it was Jack who managed to land his sword on Will, but I wasn't sure. That has been nagging me off and on for months now (and I've been too lazy to put the DVD in and watch that bit at low speed).
*is ridiculously happy over the new-found J/W moment*
The beginning of that swordfight, while the three were on the sand, moved much too quickly for me. (I muchly prefer the J/W sword play in CotBP.)
no subject
Date: 2007-01-21 01:57 am (UTC)We take what we can from a movie that offers so little of it. *G*
no subject
Date: 2007-01-21 02:02 am (UTC)no subject
Date: 2007-01-20 09:16 pm (UTC)This would indeed be a far cry from what he tells Elizabeth in CotBP, that the Pearl represents freedom.
- Silver Rose
no subject
Date: 2007-01-21 01:53 am (UTC)no subject
Date: 2007-01-21 02:05 am (UTC)- Silver Rose
no subject
Date: 2007-01-21 03:01 am (UTC)I think that's obvious. To their credit, there are some J/E people who see that, as well; it's just the ones who make no use of common storytelling sense (which really isn't all that different from regular common sense) and insist it's Lizzie that I want to shake until their teeth rattle. I can't imagine that even Jack is so horny that plucking some girl's cherry trumps the knowledge that it's Judgment Day.
And the fact that she plopped her hat on the whole mess, just invoked a complete and utter melt-down.
Ewww, icky matting sweat, Batgirl! The hat's really too small to serve as much of a sun-shield, anyway. I mean, look at Will - he keeps his hair back as much as he can. Jack doesn't, but ... well, Jack is Jack. That explains a LOT. LOL.
I won't really know how I feel about DMC until I've seen everything tied up (hopefully) in AWE.
If I absolutely love AWE, I still won't like DMC. I thought "Back to the Future 3" was nearly as good as the first movie, but I still can't watch 2 without cringing at how bad and incomplete it is.
no subject
Date: 2007-01-21 04:58 am (UTC)Including (especially!) T&T. If it wasn't for those two pushing the whole thing like a couple of demented...pushing...guys... the 'nutty' J/E faction would have nothing to point to with their 'See! see! they said it! it's canon!' shtick.
well, Jack is Jack
Maybe that's why she did it, she was hoping for some quick dreads and her very own ratty head of 'Jack' hair.
If I absolutely love AWE, I still won't like DMC
I really don't see DMC as a stand-alone movie at all, its like the part one cliffhanger of a two part sweeps extravaganza and I find it hard to judge with only half the 'story'. Not that DMC doesn't have a lot of faults (it does, piles), but a well done AWE (dream) could answer many of the questions DMC left me with.
no subject
Date: 2007-01-20 09:06 am (UTC)He does make one wonder how he managed to navigate the pirate world. Perhaps he kept himself relatively safe with sexual favors. If he once had anything like Will's beauty, he would have had plenty of "protection."
" Possibly Jack is salvageable from World's End because of this very moral act..."
I would love to see a more thorough explanation of the theology behind Jack's "purgatory" (though I've heard it described somewhere - maybe on the DMC DVD - as Jack's "personal Hell"), especially if Ragetti is doing the explaining. :-p Since, much of what we hear about AWE seems to point more at a Greco-Roman pantheon than a Judeo-Christian monotheism.
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Date: 2007-01-21 01:56 am (UTC)no subject
Date: 2007-01-21 07:21 am (UTC)Now that you mention it, Will's knowledgeable description of how to break Jack out of the lockup - in CotBP - made Jack look at him differently; maybe it reminded him of Bill?
But, no, we just don't see anything to prove that Bill has talent in DMC. Maybe finding his son in such a bad situation scrambled whatever was left of his senses.
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Date: 2007-01-20 07:09 pm (UTC)Very tiny point here: the writers mentioned this in a commentary, saying that it annoys them how far out he looks because this is not the impression they wanted to give. Apparently the current was very strong and pulled the rowboat farther out than intended.
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Date: 2007-01-21 01:48 am (UTC)no subject
Date: 2007-01-21 02:43 pm (UTC)The mobile seafood buffet, of course!
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Date: 2007-01-21 01:26 am (UTC)Well, there were a few people who joined Jones's crew on the ship recked scene where Will was captured so they obviously haven't been turned fishy yet (Since Bill's been on the ship for 8-9 years and is still fairly human). Maybe they can't breath underwater just yet? :-/
Why do Will and Bill never discuss Jack Sparrow, or Elizabeth? They are both fairly important events/people in Will's young life, and the reasons he is aboard.
I guess we have to assume that they did it while the camera's not on them because the writers probably figured having the two catch up on old times would be boring (althought talking about Jack would be very important and interesting) -.-
I still like the idea all these people in the swamp are freed slaves, or the progeny of same
O.o One of my friends who went to see the movie with us had a slightly similar thought, but he said it to be funny/racist and since my Brother and I (he came with me to see the movie! Shocker) are half black we were a little annoyed/offended.
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Date: 2007-01-21 01:51 am (UTC)Actually, this is something that has been hinted at or more openly referenced on the official movie site, that Jack was in the employ of the EITC and ran afoul of them and Beckett, which led to him being ousted for piracy and his ship sunk (thus, having to ask Davy to raise her). The notion is that he was contracted to ship slaves and refused to do it in some fashion - I don't know if we'll find out more on this in AWE, but it's a fact that African slaves were being shipped to various countries at that time, including the American colonies.
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Date: 2007-01-21 05:00 am (UTC)poor Gibbs, the Caribbean Handiwipe
and I was unable to anything but giggle. Hee!
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Date: 2007-01-21 07:21 am (UTC)no subject
Date: 2007-02-01 09:22 pm (UTC)I think they were extra-awful because Jack's supposed to be dissatisfied with them all. Yeah, I made that up. ;)
And Bill ... poor, stupid Bill ...
He was apparently even stupider in one of the earlier scripts. I remember reading that when Will shows him the picture of the key and says he's looking for it, Bill says something like, "Well you've got it right there." Now that's borderline retarded.
Why do Will and Bill never discuss Jack Sparrow, or Elizabeth?
Good question! Especially Jack.
Why is Bill clean-shaven? ... Lizzie's hair down and loose
I guess this is like those 1960s Westerns where the ladies have bee-hive hairdos. Modern styles trump historical accuracy. It's actually silly for so many characters to have facial hair. With notable exceptions (Blackbeard), there aren't many paintings or engravings that show any men with facial hair from this period. It just wasn't in style. Because Elizabeth is of a higher class, I can overlook her not wearing a cap. However, no woman would have traipsed about with her hair loose.
BTW, if you're wondering why I'm poking around in your journal, it's because I was looking for the post about Lizzie's bare legs. I read somewhere that that scene takes place in a bathhouse, and other photos from that scene reveal at least one man in a diaper-like thing. I guess she's still masquerading as a boy?
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Date: 2007-02-01 11:40 pm (UTC)Is that the post you're looking for? (I don't care if you look around - the journal's still public so far, you may as well get some enjoyment from it. *G*)
I remember reading that when Will shows him the picture of the key and says he's looking for it, Bill says something like, "Well you've got it right there."
This is something my smartass dad would come off with, but hopefully not if I were in a life-and-death situation.
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Date: 2007-02-02 04:23 am (UTC)I guess that's the problem with reading - with no tone, I took that as a dumb question instead of as a smartass one. Your way makes more sense!